diff --git a/wire/modules/Inputfield/InputfieldFile/InputfieldFile.module b/wire/modules/Inputfield/InputfieldFile/InputfieldFile.module
index 90f93050..8ac88ec2 100644
--- a/wire/modules/Inputfield/InputfieldFile/InputfieldFile.module
+++ b/wire/modules/Inputfield/InputfieldFile/InputfieldFile.module
@@ -329,7 +329,7 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 	protected function renderItemDescriptionField(Pagefile $pagefile, $id, $n) {
 		
 		$sanitizer = $this->wire()->sanitizer;
-		$languages = $this->noLang ? null : $this->wire()->languages;
+		$languages = $this->wire()->languages;
 		$user = $this->wire()->user;
 	
 		if($n) {}
@@ -341,7 +341,7 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 
 		if($this->renderValueMode) {
 			if($languages) {
-				$description = $pagefile->description($user->language);
+				$description = $pagefile->description($this->noLang ? $languages->getDefault() : $user->language);
 			} else {
 				$description = $pagefile->description;
 			}
@@ -357,11 +357,12 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 			$userLanguage = $languages ? $user->language : null;
 			$defaultDescriptionFieldLabel = $sanitizer->entities1($this->labels['description']);
 			
-			if(!$userLanguage || $languages->count() < 2) {
+			if(!$userLanguage || $languages->count() < 2 || $this->noLang) {
 				$numLanguages = 0;
-				$languages = array(null);
+				$forLanguages = array(null);
 			} else {
 				$numLanguages = $languages->count();
+				$forLanguages = $languages;
 				if(is_null($hasLangTabs)) {
 					$modules = $this->wire()->modules;
 					$hasLangTabs = $modules->isInstalled('LanguageTabs');
@@ -373,7 +374,7 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 				}
 			}
 
-			foreach($languages as $language) {
+			foreach($forLanguages as $language) {
 
 				$descriptionFieldName = "description_$id";
 				$descriptionFieldLabel = $defaultDescriptionFieldLabel;
@@ -401,6 +402,9 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 					$out .= "<div class='InputfieldFileDescription'>"; // open wrapper
 					$attrStr = "placeholder='$descriptionFieldLabel&hellip;'";
 					$labelClass = 'detail pw-hidden';
+					
+					// for the $pagefile->description($language) call further below
+					if($languages && $this->noLang) $language = $languages->getDefault();
 				}
 				
 				$attrStr = "name='$descriptionFieldName' id='$descriptionFieldName' $attrStr";
@@ -847,12 +851,16 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 	 * 
 	 */
 	protected function ___extractMetadata(Pagefile $pagefile, array $metadata = array()) {
-		
-		$metadata['description'] = $pagefile->description;
-		
-		$languages = $this->noLang ? null : $this->wire()->languages;
+	
+		$languages = $this->wire()->languages;
 		
 		if($languages) {
+			$metadata['description'] = $pagefile->description($languages->getDefault());
+		} else {
+			$metadata['description'] = $pagefile->description;
+		}
+		
+		if($languages && !$this->noLang) {
 			foreach($languages as $language) {
 				/** @var Language $language */
 				if($language->isDefault()) continue;
@@ -1026,8 +1034,10 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 		}
 	
 		// description and tags
-		$languages = $this->noLang ? null : $this->wire()->languages;
-		$keys = $languages ? array('tags') : array('description', 'tags'); 
+		// $languages = $this->noLang ? null : $this->wire()->languages;
+		$languages = $this->wire()->languages;
+		$useLanguages = $languages && !$this->noLang;
+		$keys = $useLanguages ? array('tags') : array('description', 'tags'); 
 
 		foreach($keys as $key) { 
 			if(isset($input[$key . '_' . $id])) { 
@@ -1045,6 +1055,7 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 		if($languages) {
 			foreach($languages as $language) {
 				/** @var Language $language */
+				if(!$useLanguages && !$language->isDefault()) continue;
 				if(!$languages->editable($language)) continue;
 				$key = $language->isDefault() ? "description_$id" : "description{$language->id}_$id";
 				if(!isset($input[$key])) continue;
@@ -1398,6 +1409,7 @@ class InputfieldFile extends Inputfield implements InputfieldItemList, Inputfiel
 			$this->itemFieldgroup = false;
 			$template = $pagefiles->getFieldsTemplate();
 			if(!$template) return false;
+			if($this->noLang) $template->setQuietly('noLang', 1);
 			$this->itemFieldgroup = $template->fieldgroup;
 		}
 
diff --git a/wire/modules/LanguageSupport/FieldtypeTextareaLanguage.module b/wire/modules/LanguageSupport/FieldtypeTextareaLanguage.module
index 2ce7d0e4..878291bf 100644
--- a/wire/modules/LanguageSupport/FieldtypeTextareaLanguage.module
+++ b/wire/modules/LanguageSupport/FieldtypeTextareaLanguage.module
@@ -5,7 +5,7 @@ require_once(dirname(__FILE__) . '/FieldtypeLanguageInterface.php');
 /**
  * Multi-language capable textarea field
  *
- * ProcessWire 3.x, Copyright 2016 by Ryan Cramer
+ * ProcessWire 3.x, Copyright 2023 by Ryan Cramer
  * https://processwire.com
  *
  *
@@ -19,7 +19,7 @@ class FieldtypeTextareaLanguage extends FieldtypeTextarea implements FieldtypeLa
 			'version' => 100,
 			'summary' => 'Field that stores a multiple lines of text in multiple languages',
 			'requires' => array('LanguageSupportFields')
-			);
+		);
 	}
 
 	/**
@@ -32,19 +32,28 @@ class FieldtypeTextareaLanguage extends FieldtypeTextarea implements FieldtypeLa
 	 *
 	 */
 	public function sanitizeValue(Page $page, Field $field, $value) {
-		if(is_object($value) && $value instanceof LanguagesPageFieldValue) {
-			// great, already what we wanted
-		} else {
-			// convert it to a LanguagesPageFieldValue
-			if(is_array($value)) $value = reset($value); 
-			$str = (string) $value; 
-			$value = $page->data($field->name); 
-			if(!is_object($value)) { // string, array or null
-				$value = new LanguagesPageFieldValue($page, $field, $value);
-			}
-			$value->setLanguageValue($this->wire('user')->language->id, $str); 
+		
+		if($value instanceof LanguagesPageFieldValue) return $value;
+		
+		if(is_array($value)) $value = reset($value); 
+		
+		$value = (string) $value;
+		$template = $page->template;
+		$pageValue = $page->data($field->name); 
+		
+		if(!$pageValue instanceof LanguagesPageFieldValue) { // string, array or null
+			$pageValue = new LanguagesPageFieldValue($page, $field, $value);
 		}
-		return $value; 
+		
+		if($template && $template->noLang) {
+			$languages = $this->wire()->languages;
+			$pageValue->setLanguageValue($languages->getDefault()->id, $value);
+		} else {
+			$language = $this->wire()->user->language;
+			if($language) $pageValue->setLanguageValue($language->id, $value);
+		}
+		
+		return $pageValue; 
 	}
 
 	/**
@@ -56,7 +65,8 @@ class FieldtypeTextareaLanguage extends FieldtypeTextarea implements FieldtypeLa
 	 */
 	public function getDatabaseSchema(Field $field) {
 		$schema = parent::getDatabaseSchema($field);
-		$languageSupport = $this->wire('modules')->get('LanguageSupport'); 
+		/** @var LanguageSupport $languageSupport */
+		$languageSupport = $this->wire()->modules->get('LanguageSupport'); 
 		foreach($languageSupport->otherLanguagePageIDs as $languageID) {
 			// $schema['data' . $languageID] = $schema['data'];
 			$schema['data' . $languageID] = 'mediumtext';
@@ -92,7 +102,7 @@ class FieldtypeTextareaLanguage extends FieldtypeTextarea implements FieldtypeLa
 		// in this method we are delegating the exportValue() to FieldtypeTextLanguage::exportValue
 		// but we want to make sure it has textarea sleepValue, so we pass sleepValue in the $options
 		if(!isset($options['sleepValue'])) $options['sleepValue'] = $this->sleepValue($page, $field, $value);
-		$exportValue = $this->wire('fieldtypes')->get('FieldtypeTextLanguage')->___exportValue($page, $field, $value, $options);
+		$exportValue = $this->wire()->fieldtypes->get('FieldtypeTextLanguage')->___exportValue($page, $field, $value, $options);
 		return $exportValue; 
 	}
 
@@ -107,11 +117,10 @@ class FieldtypeTextareaLanguage extends FieldtypeTextarea implements FieldtypeLa
 	 * 
 	 */
 	public function ___importValue(Page $page, Field $field, $value, array $options = array()) {
-		/** @var Languages $languages */
-		$languages = $this->wire('languages');
+		$languages = $this->wire()->languages;
 	
 		/** @var LanguagesPageFieldValue $importValue */
-		$importValue = $this->wire('fieldtypes')->get('FieldtypeTextLanguage')->___importValue($page, $field, $value, $options);
+		$importValue = $this->wire()->fieldtypes->get('FieldtypeTextLanguage')->___importValue($page, $field, $value, $options);
 		
 		foreach($languages as $language) {
 			$languageValue = $importValue->getLanguageValue($language->id);